Interview with Cadence Keys

Emma Dhesi  00:00

Cadence Keys writes steamy, contemporary sports romance stories about complex alpha males and the women who love them. She loves football, coffee and watching Gilmore girl marathons. She has been raising for almost a decade knows or has lots to share with us. But only recently did she get the gumption to really do something with her work. She looks forward to publishing many more novels, especially her le wolf series, let’s find out what cadence can teach us about getting started in our writing lives. Welcome to the turning readers into writers Podcast, where we teach beginner writers how to find the time and the confidence to write their first novel. I’m your host, Emma Desi. And I’m very excited that you’re here. Thank you for joining me today. Because if you’ve been longing to write your novel for forever, then this is the place to be Think of this as your weekly dose of encouragement of hand holding and general cheerleading, as you figure out how you’re going to write your first novel. Trust me, as a mom of three young kids, I know how tricky it can be to tuck some time aside for yourself on a regular basis. And even when you do find that spare five minutes, you can feel so overwhelmed that no rating gets done. Trust me, I have been there. But this podcast is going to help you in practical ways. Because once a week, I’ll be delivering an episode that gives you steps to building a writing routine, encouragement to build your confidence and cheerleading until you reach the end. Okay, let’s start. Well, thank you cadence for joining me today. I’m really thrilled to have you on the show. Yeah, thanks for having me. I wonder if we could just start by you telling us a little bit about yourself, and what drew you to writing how you started writing. 

Cadence Keys  02:01

I’ve always loved writing, I was an only child for a really long time. And so my imagination would run rampant. And I loved reading. I was one of the last kids in my class to actually learn how to read. But once I started, I never put a book down. I would carry books with me in my purses whenever I’d go somewhere. Like I always had a book. So we mentioned what Kindle was really exciting for me. But yeah, so I’ve always been an avid reader. But I and I would write kind of on the side but never really got the confidence to pursue it, mainly because I just thought it was something you had to do. You had to be through a big five publisher and you had to go through all of that there was no way and then with the, you know, rise in self publishing and it becoming more acceptable to be a self published author. I finally decided to push forward and try my hand at that. 

Emma Dhesi  02:54

fantastic was very similar to mine. And I was quite slow to start reading. But once I did that was it I couldn’t believe this whole other universe opened up in my life, I think Well, probably the same just was never the same again. So now you write a romance and you’ve said you write steamy romance. And so without without getting having to give myself the E reading on their iPads. And what’s the sort of main difference between a standard kind of mills and boons romance and steamy romance? 

Cadence Keys  03:29

I don’t know mills and boons. 

Emma Dhesi  03:32

Ah, okay, so like Harlequin, you know, sort of our Okay, we begin the eating. Yeah, so 

Cadence Keys  03:39

I’ve not read a lot of Harlequin. I know that’s probably like big romance. No, no, but um, I don’t know, I feel like this is kind of a questionable thing. Because there’s so many different levels of themes. These days, like I hear some authors are like, oh, I’ve got a mid level theme. And I was like, What is the mid level theme? And so I guess there they say it depends on the number of themes where you get very, there’s more visuals of what’s happening in the intimate moments. And so, um, so for me, I, I see it as steamy because I have a couple of those, like just a handful. But for me, that would be a mess that if I were reading, if I were expecting a clean romance, I would probably be really jarred to open my book and read it. Or even if I was expecting, like, you know, low theme, or low intimacy or more closed door where it’s implied but nothing’s actually stated. Versus mine is actually hated. So. Yeah. 

Emma Dhesi  04:43

I see that. Yeah. So you’re writing the LA wolves series. So tell us a little bit about that series. 

Cadence Keys  04:55

So this le will series started off with jack which is the lead In a football theory of American football, I should say it’s an American football series that started with jack. He’s book. He’s one of the main characters, a male lead and book one. And it just kind of came to me. And as I was writing that, that first story, I was like, What about if this player had a story, and there’s some chemistry between Paige she’s my female lead in that book, her best friend and one of the other players on the team. And I was like, Well, what if they got a story, and then it just buy over from there. And I now have five books that I’m planning to release next year, or through the, from here on out, there will be five releases between December of this year in December of next year, in that series that are all interconnected standalone. 

Emma Dhesi  05:48

I was just gonna ask you to indicate if it was a serial or so you have. You’ve published the novella, the prequel novella, and then they are coming in three month intervals. So I I only write standalones, I don’t write to us at all. So my, to my mind, I’m thinking, oh, wow, that’s super intensive. How have you gone about writing the series? Are you doing them all in advance? Are you writing them and kind of one after the other? 

Cadence Keys  06:19

So I guess a little bit of both, I don’t like to write two stories at one. But I will work on editing a story and writing a story. So for example, I have like three projects right now. So book one, the novella is also being I give out for free to people who sign up for my newsletter. And then, and that’s just kind of their jackin page, it’s a second chance romance. So their story is just, it’s just a preview to their story. So that book, in the graph is the first one and that comes out in December, that one’s basically done. I’m just waiting for December to get here. Book Two is across the middle. And that book is in editing stages. I wrote it in September, in three weeks doing sprinting, which I’m now a huge advocate for sprinting. I like think it’s the best thing in the world. And I can definitely talk about that if you want me to Yeah. So I wrote that in three weeks, three and a half week during sprinting. And then I’m currently editing working on editing that one. And I’m prepping for Book Three, which I will be doing, that’s my NaNoWriMo project. So I’m doing NaNoWriMo. And I plan to get the first draft of that done during November. 

Emma Dhesi  07:39

Cool. I’m gonna do nano as well. So I’ll be thinking about you. So you haven’t planned paying for that at the moment? What does prep for NaNoWriMo mean for you? Oh, 

Cadence Keys  07:49

I’m kind of old school. I love No cards. I know lots of people are like, Oh, I want to buy plotter and do all these things. There are all these different programmes and I just can’t do it. One because I stare at a screen enough during the day that I it’s just too much. And I jot notes down throughout the day or put them on my phone throughout the day of ideas. And so I usually get note cards so I’ll so yeah, so I’ve got no cards for I basically break it down by chapter like if I see specific scenes, I put that scene on note card. And that ends up being a chapter and I kind of have like chapter goals for a novel. But I’m also I also leave myself some room to add things. Because like, for example, my last book, or book two that I just finished the first round or first draft of that one, I had all my note cards, my outline several themes, like really ready to go. And then as I was writing it, I realised there was a whole chunk that I was like, No, this happens too soon. And so I ended up adding like five chapters in between to really lengthen it out and add more depth, I thought to their characters and mirror their building relationship. And so that’s what I like about notecards is then I can lay it back out and say, okay, where does this fit? or How can I adjust things without throwing off how I’d really visualise the story. And I also find that it makes editing, going back and editing a lot easier, because I already see how everything plays out. And so I can just go back and figure out okay, where does this fit appropriately, but it won’t totally throw things off. And it will enhance the story instead of just being like wow, this came out of left field. Yeah. So, so I’m old school and, and that worked for me. And then I do some other things. I’ve been learning some other techniques to dive a little bit deeper into my characters I’m currently taking Mary bekam plotting course, break into fiction. And that’s been super wonderful. Just to help me really dive deep in knowing who my characters are, and make sure that my conflicts aren’t meaningless that they are They have point and purpose. They’re not just I’m not just throwing a bus in front of them to throw a bus in front of them. But that there’s a point and they’re given a choice. And we see the poll between what choice do I make? Why am I Why is this even a struggle for me? And so I feel like my characters for my next book are going to be even deeper. Because of, of all that work that we’ve been doing. 

Emma Dhesi  10:27

Mary Buckham, I’ll put a note of that in the show notes. That’s interesting. 

Cadence Keys  10:36

Yeah. Yeah. So I found out about it through Alexandre Tory ingrooves group, somebody had dropped it in and I it was about a plotting thing. It was a free webinar. And I like to plot, but I don’t like to strict plot. But I do like the plot. And I was like, well, maybe this will help me plot a little bit better. You know, because you never know what you don’t know what you don’t know until you find out what you don’t know. So. So then I signed up for this full course, because I did learn some things. But I was like, Oh, I didn’t know that. So I signed up for the full course. And I’m loving it so far. I find I find it really helpful. And it’s made me look at my characters in a way I never had before. 

Emma Dhesi  11:14

Oh, fantastic. I’m gonna check that out myself. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Character development. It’s them. It’s, it’s I’m realising that and realising more and more just how important that is. It’s not just about the storyline, but about the equal stay as well. Yeah. 

Cadence Keys  11:30

Yeah. Especially in romance, because romance is so character driven. That we have to have a strong characters. 

Emma Dhesi  11:39

So yeah, I know, you mentioned and sprinting and that you, you’ve fallen in love with sprinting. So tell us about your methods. 

Cadence Keys  11:46

Yeah, so I love sprinting, I have a baby at home, and I have a full time job. So my time is super limited and not my own. And I love printing because I can definitely find i. So I had watched a webinar about it, where the people recommended either doing like 25 on and five minutes off, and then 25 on and five minutes off, or you sprint for an hour. And I was like 25 minutes doesn’t feel long enough to me. So I feel like I’m just yeah, it just doesn’t feel quite long enough. And then an hour feels too long. I was like, I don’t know that I can find an hour at a time. So I started sprinting, doing 30 minute intervals. Because I was like, I know, I can dedicate 30 minutes. And what really struck me about their advice about sprinting was that you have to shut off your editor, your internal editor, which is something that I didn’t realise how badly my internal editor was getting in my own way. And, and so it really does help you shut it off. Because you just have to write, you just have to go, you just have to get the words on the page. And you can go back and fix that later. But you can’t fix with not written. And so I thought that was really powerful advice. And so I do 30 minute intervals. And I have found I’m a pretty fast typer. So depending on what scene I’m working on, or if I’m well usually, depending on what scene I’m working on, depends on the word count. But I can usually get anywhere from 1100 to 1600. We’re in a 30 minute sprint. So if Yeah, and so there have been a couple times, like if I’ve been having a really off day, or just like my writing Mojo was totally gone, I maybe got like 800 but I can usually get a pretty decent chunk out. So if my goal for the day is like 3000 I can bump that out, usually like two or three sprints, which also helps. Yeah, which helps, it also helps me feel one more productive and two more efficient because I if I have this big lofty goal like 3000 words a day, that’s a lot. That’s a lot of words in a day. But knowing I’m like, oh, but I know that my word. This is my average word count when I do a half hour sprint. So really, when I break that down, at most, that’s like three Sprint’s that’s an hour and a half out of my day. And then it makes it feel so much more manageable. Instead of like staring at a computer like oh my god, I have 30,000 words I have to write, you know, which feels like it’s the hardest thing in the universe. And so it just it helps mentally me be able to get those words on a page one because it shuts off my internal editor and two because it gets me out of my own head of like, Oh my god, this is so many words. And so I love it. I would write I rave about it to everybody that I can I’m like have you tried sprinting sprinting is amazing. When I first started using it, I didn’t have a whole lot of writing buddies yet. Because I’m I was just getting really active into the writing world and writing community. And so I would hold myself accountable by putting on Twitter, like hey, I’m starting a 30 minute sprint. In Touch later, and people would actually comment, like, because I would do like hashtag sprinting or hashtag and writing romance or whatever. And people would actually comment like, hey, the book or you know, what’s your account and and then I’d post it later again, it just helped me feel accountable of like, yep, there’s somebody there that is gonna notice, oh, hey, she had her word count, or Hey, she, she did finish her sprint. So that was one way for me to hold myself. Come on. Now I have writing buddies, but we all talk about sprinting together. And we all have equally crazy busy lives. So. So that’s fun.

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Emma Dhesi  15:34

I love that it’s certainly something I do encourage all of my students to do is get a an idea of roughly how much you can write in any given timeframe. And then you can, as you see kind of shedule that through your day or through your week. And for me scheduling, particularly in the early stages, when you’re transitioning from somebody who writes just for fun to somebody who’s wanting to be more intentional with their writing, I really, really encourage my students to shedule in their writing time as well over the the forthcoming week. Do you plan ahead with your writing over the week? Or do you do write every day for example? Or do you know that you’ve got c two days available to you when you can do your writing Sprint’s How do you try and formula formulate that over your week. 

Cadence Keys  16:22

So I try to write at least a little bit every day, when I’m writing something new. Once I hit like the editing stages that kind of adjust a little bit. But when I’m in the middle of writing something new, I try to write a little bit every day, even if it’s just 500 words. And so I find that I write the best in the morning, I’m just usually way too tired at night, and I fall asleep, my kid falls asleep. And so I try to get up a little early if I can, and do like 30 minutes before I have to go to work. And then, you know, on my lunch break, I’ll try to do 30 minutes there. Sometimes I’ve used text to voice or voice to text to just because sometimes you can’t typer I hate typing long stuff on my phone. It just gets, it just feels like a lot of work to me, I prefer typing on a keyboard because I’m faster. And so I’ll just talk into my phone and get it all out that way. So those are ways because those words still count. Like you may not be typing them, but they still count. And then the other thing is, I think the biggest thing for me is not comparing myself to other writers because it’s really easy in this community. There are so many writers doing amazing things for us to compare like, Oh, no, I’m, I’m not writing as much or I’m not doing as much or I’m not releasing as many books. And that pressure can really get in your way. And so just knowing like, whatever’s good for you is good for you. Like you’ll work your way up. You know, it took me four years to write my first book. So the fact that I could even the fact that I’m even taking the time every day to write my second and now my third, like that, to me is progress. And so I just keep that in mind on days when I can’t write as much. And then on weekends, but I usually try to write more because I can write more while my my son is napping or I just have more time during the day because I don’t have my job. 

Emma Dhesi  18:17

Yeah, it’s just so organised. I’m so impressed by your your energy to having your baby. 

Cadence Keys  18:24

Yeah, well, I have a hand planner that I use for like all my writing, like to structure all my like if I writing stuff or takeovers or like webinars that I want to watch, and then like my phone, I have my calendar up on my phone that has everything else on there. I mean, yeah, it takes a lot of work to get organised. And I’m definitely like losing a lot of things, I’m sure but I just I found I love writing and it feeds my soul in a way that nothing really ever has before. And I having my son just really kind of inspired me to pursue it because I want him to be able to pursue his dreams and what really makes him thrive. And so just finding even the half an hour a day to me, is my self care. Like that’s how I take care of myself and that’s how I was okay, this is mommy’s time. And I’m just going to write and then I feel good. And it’s my creative outlet. And you know, I’ve made lots of friends down this community and those are my people, you know, and like we get each other and, and so it’s it’s just like it feeds my soul. And so I I find that I have to make time for it or else I start to just get stressed out and kind of grumpy. 

Emma Dhesi  19:38

It is true. I am a big believer that in that. A happy mummy equals a happy happy baby 

Cadence Keys  19:44

very much so yeah. 

Emma Dhesi  19:46

Now you mentioned Can you see there before so you’ve said that when you first started you put on Twitter to just give yourself a feeling of accountability. But no, you have either accountability buddies or just kind of writing friends. Did you find them through Twitter or? 

Cadence Keys  20:02

No. So I’m actually like not even super active on Twitter, I really only use Twitter for when I need that, like extra accountability or something. I found them all through Facebook, which I’ve never been a super huge fan of Facebook. But the but I’ve really loved the writing world, at least the ones I’ve stumbled on, I’ve heard there are some that are hit or miss. But the writing world I’ve found I really love and they’re all on Facebook. So the interest group, I’ll senatore English group. That was my first experience with a writing community. And I found so much information from there. In fact, I was on tutorial publishing course, was the first thing I ever, like, read or not read on publishing, but it’s what really helped guide my publishing journey and the structure that I took, at least getting started. And so that was my first group. And then I’m a wide author, I published wide and not and not exclusive to Amazon. And so I joined the wide for the wind group on Facebook, which is awesome. I love that group. Fish those that love it. But yeah, so I love going on there and seeing what people are talking about and different strategies that people use. And then I’ve got another group, just like kind of a beginning writing romance group, we’re all kind of freshly getting started. But all in different stages, some of us have published multiples, some of us haven’t published at all. And so it’s just a very diverse group. But we’re all supportive. And we’re all like, Okay, so what are you doing to do this? And how do you feel about these and, you know, so it’s been, it’s been fun to get to know each other. And now we start, we started zooming in zoom meeting, where we actually could like, see each other and just chat about life, or books, or whatever. And so it’s really been awesome. And that all just happened organically, I get started, I joined one group. And the thing is you have to participate in the community, that’s what I found, you have to be an active participant, not just a fly on the wall. And that’s really for your benefit, because I get so much more out of building those relationships, than if I just sit back and passively scroll through the comments. I might even though I get a lot of information out of like the wind for the wind group, I’m not as active on there, because I’m, I’m not fully published yet, like my first book is still kind of getting ready to grow. So I know that I’ll be more active once I actually feel like I have something valuable to say. But in my other groups, I tried to, you know, be as active as I can when I have the time because obviously social media is its own beast of time management. But, but yeah, just being really active in that community. And not for what not just for what you can get out of it before you can give back. Like if you can say, hey, you’re like, if you see someone’s freaking out, hey, you’re not alone, like this is really overwhelming and stressful. Just keep your head up, like you’ve got this, like even to something like that. You don’t have to have any publishing experience to be a shoulder for somebody or just like a cheerleader for somebody. And that can be really powerful because it makes someone feel heard and seen. And so I think that’s just the biggest piece of being active.  

Emma Dhesi  23:27

Yeah, no, I said, lovely. I am you just kind of a member of a few groups, because I’ve discovered because Facebook groups are so big. Now I’ve discovered them. I feel like I’m a member of hundreds of them. And it’s difficult to actually participate in so many groups. And have you been quite selective about the ones that you’re a member of, or the ones that you participate in? 

Cadence Keys  23:49

Yeah, so I’m a member of a lot because I do takeovers. And so I will participate still, like in some of those groups. If I see stuff like I’ll drop comments in or as needed. Or I still thought like I’m in some author groups. Because I’m myself, I’m Canada’s authors. And so I’ll totally comment like, just the other day. Take a number by Amy Dawes came out and I and she loves Gilmore Girls, I love Gilmore Girls. And so, you know, I definitely commented on how much I loved the opening Gilmore Girls argument scene. And, and I do that kind of stuff all the time. Well, when I can, because I still, it’s still a lot to comment on. Like there’s so much that goes on. And there’s hundreds of comments, but even just dropping in there. And then there are, I would say, three writing groups that I’m a part of that I’m active in participating in. And those ones I definitely prioritise just because I feel like I’ve done so much from that community that I want to nurture that relationship and give back.

Emma Dhesi  24:58

Good advice there. I think I need to take Take your advice on that one. Yeah. And I think if I want my other question was going to be kind of around how you balance your writing time with working full time and having family. And I think you’ve kind of answered that. And I’m guessing that your partner is supportive of your writing and kind of facilitates that as well. Because it’s not about what’s going on in our brains as a solo activity, that kind of the writing life is not a solo job, we kind of need other people around to support us. So do you get that from your partner? 

Cadence Keys  25:32

Oh, absolutely. Yeah, my husband is probably my biggest cheerleader. He’s actually the one who pushed me to publish in the first place. He’s like, you need to get the story out there. Like you need to write like this. This is good for you, and you love doing this. And so he is constantly cheering me on and helping out when he can. And I know cuz he works, too. And so he’s been a huge support. It’s like watching our time, even now, for my longtime listener, DJ. He is, you know, he’s just awesome and been very supportive. And I frankly, couldn’t have done what I’ve done without his support. 

Emma Dhesi  26:09

Now talking of family, and I knew that you use a pen name, I’m not going to ask for your real name. But I do like your name, and it does m cadence keys, it does fit a few very well with your genre. How did you sort of come up with the name and or why did you feel the need for a pen name. 

Cadence Keys  26:28

I’ve always loved alliteration. And so I just loved the flow of Katie’s keys. And I see a lot of like, new generic last names when people go pen names, but I didn’t want to be so generic like stone because I feel like I’ve seen a tonne of authors with last name stone, or something like that. And so I looked up different author names. I even went on like the romance Writers of America membership list and was like, How many? No, okay, and I thought of different names, different like last names, but I like 10 different first names that I like. Although I’ve always been leaning towards Kayden, because I just love the meaning of the word. You know, it’s about that rhythm and flow and, and I was like, How appropriate for a writer. And it’s beautiful. It’s a beautiful name. And, and so I was like, Okay, well, looking at that Katy keys, like, Oh, that’s a full name. So I looked at that, and then hardly any, like, I didn’t see how many keeps us like, okay, so no one was confused me with someone else. And that, to me, was kind of important. And so that was the thinking behind that. 

Emma Dhesi  27:36

It’s nice. It’s nice. And why? Why did you feel the need for a pen name rather than your own. 

Cadence Keys  27:45

So nobody in my life outside of my family, and a very, very select few friends know that I even write novels, let alone steamy romance novels. And so I, I didn’t want people at my job knowing. Because I just really wanted to keep that life separate. And it’s not like a, it’s not a I’m not ashamed of my writing. Like, I am very proud. I think it’s a huge accomplishment. And so I’m very proud of the work that I’ve put out that I’m about to put out. But it was just, I don’t feel there’s a lot of judgement around romance. Like if people aren’t in that world. And for my professional career, like I need my job. And so I just felt keeping it separate, was for the best. In the long term, I’d love to go full time as a writer down the line. And so, you know, keeping a pen name would be fine for that. So that that was the main reason was just, I didn’t want people in my real life to know until I was ready to let that one out. So when I go full time, then I’ll be like, Hello World. 

Emma Dhesi  29:00

Fair enough. I think those are fair enough reasons. Now I’ve been on and I’ve had a look at your website. And it’s a really good site it’s in, you know, it’s quite as quite simple one, but it does everything that you need. And it’s got really nice graphics and movement on the page and stuff. So wonder though, it made me think, Oh, I wonder what you’re doing in terms of kind of marketing and advertising and that kind of thing. Because I think, especially for indie authors, but maybe traditional authors as well. The biggest job in our life, we think is going to be to just write this book, and then we write the book and we publish it and we realise, oh, my goodness, actually, something to work has just begun. So wondering what your thoughts were on marketing, whether you’ve put anything into place or whether you’re going to wait till we’ve released everything and then and then sort of do a big push what’s what’s your strategy?  

Cadence Keys  29:54

At the moment, there’s a little bit of a hybrid of that. So my my current strategy is I’m not paying for ad I’m not even paying for paid newsletters just yet. That is my plan here probably in the next book or two, I. So I currently try to push everything to my website, because I’m a white author. So I’m not on just one platform. So I try to keep my website really up to date with everything. And then I do a newsletter that goes out once a month. And I’m using story origin, which is in its beta stages, right now it’s free. So if you’re brand new writer, or just starting out, that would be a great resource to start building up your newsletter, and they’ve got all kinds of tips for how to do that. And so that’s where I started. And I use my novella, intentional grounding, which is the prequels to book one as my reader magnet. So whoever signs up for my newsletter, they get that for free. And so I’ve done that is a little bit of a marketing strategy, I am really active on social media, primarily Facebook, and Instagram, I post at least once a day. And I schedule those posts, usually about a week in advance, so that my week I can focus on writing. And then for the book release, because there’s a lot behind a book release that we don’t really think about when we’re writing the book. So I really wanted to get my book out there in front of as many eyes as possible, but I just didn’t have those kinds of relationships cultivated just yet. And I’m sure it’ll probably take me more time. And so I hired a PR company, to do my cover, reveal, reach out to bloggers, but cover reveal arc, and then a blog tour the first week of release. And so they’re handling all of that, which, on the one hand to the load of stress off my shoulders, because I could focus on, you know, formatting and then editing Book Two. And at the same time, it’s a little bit terrifying, because I’m like, how many people signed up? Is anybody going to read my book? So, yeah, but my cover reels in a week and a half, but then I’m sure I’ll start seeing where we’re at with that. 

Emma Dhesi  32:10

And how did you find the company? I wouldn’t know where to start. 

Cadence Keys  32:15

Yeah, so Britain cook group, they’ve been great. Like I like and that’s the thing is, it’s a pay to work. Sometimes I’m like, I’ve definitely stumbled on a lot of really good information just by like, cool. Yeah, this is I’m curious about this. And so I found that group on the interest group, and quite a few people had worked with them and spoke highly of them. And they were within my budget, because that was the thing I, I did have a very tight budget for this first book. Because I am treating my writing like a business and getting a business started is expensive. And so you know, the priorities when you’re starting out are going to professional cover, because that’s the first thing your readers are going to see. Make sure that the genre you’re writing in, like I looked at a lot of different sports romance covers, before deciding what to do with and working with my designer who was amazing, I absolutely adore her. And so, you know, making sure it fits. And then editing, make sure you have good editing, I was fortunate enough to have some connections that I didn’t even realise I had until I was like freaking out like, Oh my god, I cannot afford, you know, this, because editing can be really expensive, especially the more word count you can have. And I was just like, I cannot afford this. But then I realised I have some connections. And I utilise those instead to to save me a little bit of money. But that’s where a lot of your expenses should go is to those things first, and then all the add stuff can come later. But I I decided to take a chunk of that change and put it towards this as a way to promote since it is my first book, I don’t have a huge audience yet, but I want to get it out there.

Emma Dhesi  34:05

So that sounds really sensible. I just particularly holding back on the ad spend. I did I did pay for ads for my first book. And and it was it was good experience to do I kind of understand it a little bit more. And I did see some return on it. But I think is particularly if you’re writing series, it’s best to wait till you’ve got them all out. And then you can really push the first book in series and then get the renew. So one of the things I enjoy actually about the indie world but and is that you’re always learning it’s, you know, it’s easy to get overwhelmed by it all. But if you just take one little bit at a time and learn about that before we move on to the next. There’s always something new and fun to learn and you begin to get a feel for what you enjoy doing and what you don’t enjoy doing. 

Cadence Keys  34:53

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, it’s good. Yeah, 

Emma Dhesi  34:55

I’m knowing just going to turn kind of turn direction for them. And then sort of talk about more of the craft side of writing. And when it comes to romance. I know that there are it’s kind of quite famous for the different tropes, that it’s got the expectations within, in the many, many sub genres of romance, and who have you kind of turned to to help you with that side of things? Or has that come quite organically, because you read in that genre, too. 

Cadence Keys  35:25

I think it’s come organically, because I do read heavily in that sauna. Because that’s primarily all I read these days, as well, man, and I just soak it up. But when I’m looking for inspiration, I definitely have a few authors that I’ll go to, for craft. And those are typically morlin page. She right, like beautiful, I mean, they’re dark and twisty. But they’re totally beautiful. And so well crafted, like the writing is just, I could get lost in the writing for days. And she’s definitely like a one click author for me, because I know I’ll always get a good story, and really developed characters. And so she’s one of my go to, I’m Megan Quinn, I also really like her. Her she does sports romance. So I really like reading her sports romance. And she again, does a really great job of craft. But the writing is just beautiful. The characters are developed. And and then Amy dies is another one I really like. And she she does a nice job of that as well of all those things. And so whenever I am getting kind of stuck, or just need inspiration, usually I’ll go to one of my go to authors and just see how do they develop these stories, you know, or, or I’ll read some of my all time favourites, I’ll just reread a favourite book so that me by Jennifer creepy, was the first romance I ever read. And so that book holds a very special place in my heart. I was like 13 and stumbled on it in the library. And I will go back I read I read that book probably like a million times, because I just I love it. And it’s, you know, the older I get, and the more I read it. And now that I’m looking at as a writer, you know, it’s just still so beautiful. Like, I could just read it endlessly. Samantha young is another one. And she’s actually a Scottish author. I love her. Her books are long, but they’re long, because they’re long with a purpose for you that doesn’t feel endless, and really build that backstory. And she must never fails to make me cry. Which I guess is like the sign of a good author, because I’m always so invested in the last book of hers I read was black tangled heart, and I was just literally like a ball of tears. I was like, thank you, Samantha young. But I like it Really? Yeah. Yeah. Her on Dublin street series is what got me started on her. And it’s so well written. It’s really great.  

Emma Dhesi  37:57

Well, I’ll link to these in the show notes so others can go and discover them too. So you’ve said that you’re working on Book Two and Three at the moment. And so I can imagine that you’re going to keep up with your schedule, and people can see your release schedule on your website. But I’m wondering if you have any plans for once the series is finished, you know, is there Do you know that you want to stay writing in in romance, for example, perhaps move on to another team or another sports or something different altogether. 

Cadence Keys  38:29

So I have several other ideas. So I do think that the next. So after these first five books, I’ll probably take a little mini break from the sport. But my idea with Ellie wools is that they could kind of be endless. Because players could get traded in I mean, made so much that could happen with that, which is one of the things I love about it. But I did so in Book Two bears. There’s a rock star that gets introduced. And there’s going to be a spin off series with him. So he’s a friend of the main male lead and book two. And, and so he’s going to have his own series and this going to be a four book series. So that one’s going to be just a set number of books on each of the people, the men in a band. Okay. And then I do have a couple other ideas. My husband is ex military. And so I’ve talked to him about helping me write some military romance, which he always laughed that because he doesn’t understand our love for men in uniform but uniform so. So you know, there might be some of those. I’ve got some of those stories down and then I have one. One story that’s pretty close to the my heart because it’s a fairly personal story, and one I probably relate to the most and would definitely be putting a lot of myself And that story. But I don’t know that I’m ready to write it. But down the line, I would love to, I’ve got quite a few chunks of that already written. But it’s just a very emotional story. And so it’s one that I have to write it and release it when I’m ready. And I just been tired to go back to right now. 

Emma Dhesi  40:17

So yeah, I was talking to someone who teaches people to write biography and memoir. And she that was her recommendation is when you’re still so close to it. And it’s hard to write about it, not just passionately, but with a degree of objectiveness. And so you’ll know when your body kind of will tell you when you’re ready to put this out and ready to write them. It’s really interesting how our bodies can be a real kind of guide to us in our writing in this kind of what’s going on in our head. I was just interested in what you were seeing there about a lot because I’ve talked to a few romance writers now. And as an interesting thing, I’ve noticed that romance readers really love, not just the principal characters in book one, but they want to know about the best friends and then the Friends of the best friends, and so on and so forth, for getting to know a whole school or a whole tone. And I think that’s quite like that aspects of the kind of romance world, but it’s, it makes it I suppose it fits in with a sort of romance idea, but it’s like this big cosy family and everybody gets to know Yeah, big family where there’s lots of disputes and disharmony. But then everyone comes together again at the end and makes friends and or is that then is that kind of stories that you enjoy as well? 

Cadence Keys  41:34

Yeah, well, yeah, I do. And I, you know, I didn’t even think about doing the rock star series really came out of I was writing books, too. And I was like, oh, how cool would it be, you know, if they know each other, and then, you know, oh, and then he could have a spin off. And then it was like, oh, and then I just like, was down the rabbit hole. And now I’m, like, you know, outlining. Yeah, it is, uh, you know, I do love that, because I do get very curious about those side characters. And so then I love it when they get their own book, which is probably why I was driven to write interconnected standalone, because all those characters are going to be introduced when we see them and, and I love that you see them from someone else’s lens. But then you get to see them from their own perspective. And it’s like, wow, like, there’s so much more to a person, which I think is true in life, like you can see someone but you don’t know their story. But I do think it’s really funny because my, my best friend read my book. And she was like, I want to know more about max. And Max is the best friend and personal assistant to jack who’s my lead character. And I had no intentions of ever writing a story about Matt. And she was like, I need a story about max. And so now like, Max is going to get himself a novella down the line. All right, all right, on my story, you know, and, and there are little pieces that have come up kind of organically, you know, now in Book Three, is there’s, there’s some max stuff happening, and I’m like, Okay, okay, so he’s gonna get into eventually, but because she keeps asking me about it, 

Emma Dhesi  43:00

I love it a lot. You never kind of obeyed years, that way is great. Now, I’m very conscious of time, I’ve taken a lot of your time. So I wonder if you could just let listeners know where they could find you online. 

Cadence Keys  43:12

Yeah, so the best place to find me would be my website, which is cadence Keith author.com. And from there, I’ve got links to my social media. I’m on Instagram King, cube author and Facebook came keys, and I’ve got a reader reader group on Facebook as well, King keys, book lovers. And so yeah, feel free to find me on there and join my newsletter, because my cover reveal is next Thursday, but newsletter subscribers will get to see it on the fourth. Because I’m gonna I can’t hold on to it anymore. And so yeah, so I send out lots of freebies and things in my newsletter, and I don’t spam people. I hate getting newsletters, like every week. So yeah, so those are the best ways to get in touch. 

Emma Dhesi  44:02

Lovely. That’s great. Well, cadence keys. Thank you so much for your time today. 

Cadence Keys  44:07

Thank you.

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Emma Dhesi

Emma writes women’s fiction. She began writing seriously while a stay at home mum with 3 pre-school children.

By changing her mindset, being consistent and developing confidence, Emma has gone from having a collection of handwritten notes to a fully written, edited and published novel.

Having experienced first-hand how writing changes lives, Emma now helps beginner writers find the time and confidence to write their first novel.